Some people dream of bigger engines, better steering and suspension,
maybe even a 4- speed...and then sometimes the dream is as mundane as a
new gas tank.
I snapped this, very quickly, this morning. I'll add more (aka better) pictures
later.
I'll also post this on the Yahoo group site for " Too much crap in my garage - A
place for all things overwhelming ones life"

Group,  I just posted a number of new photos for the group.  You will
find them in the Brochure folder and a new folder called Technical.
Enjoy.

Brad.

Pat,  All good questions.  I don't think we will ever know the true
answers to some of your questions but I am willing to take a stab at
some of them.

> Most cars have a hood scoop. But some came without it.

As for the hood scoop, keep in mind that each of these cars were hand
made and Italian coach works craftsman often modified a design just
to experiment.

> Many cars have a front scoop under the bumper as part of the body,
ala a Mangusta. Most don't. (you can just make it out on the red one
with the white top, if you go to the brochure in the photos section.)

As for the scoop under the bumper, I noticed this myself a few months
ago and I wondered about it too.  My car doesn't have the scoop.
My
car is number 45 and wonder if Ghia started with the scoop under the
car and at a particular number decided to make it cleaner.  Maybe the
members on this list can chime in with their car number and the if it
has a hood or under bumper scoop.

> Some cars have chrome strips beneath the doors with spring loaded
jack- hole covers. Most don't.

This one has perplexed me.  From what I have been able to see, most
if not all of the original factory photos don't show a chrome
strip
over the jack-holes covers.  I believe that some people have covered
them up because the holes aren't the most appealing.

> The turn signal indicators, the blue high beam indicator, and the
green (non operating on mine) light seem to vary in thier dash
placement. As does the  blank brass plaque on the glove box. ( I have
an ad mentioning it being there  so you could pesonalize your car.)

I have posted a drawing in the literature section of the web site
which details the entire dash and what each switch is suppose to do
and what all the lights on the dash are for. Not many of the switches
or lights worked on my car when I got it.  I had the entire
electrical system reengineered and rewired.  Originally the car had 6
fuses, a few inline circuit breakers and just a few relays, my car
now has 26 fuses and a lot more relays.  The wiring on these cars is
way underrated.  If you are having electrical problems, I recommend
that you don't use the 1966 Barracuda wiring harness.

As for the plaque, mine is also blank.  Does anyone have a name on
theirs?

> The license plate lights on the rear bumper vary greatly.

  My car doesn't have a license plate light but if I look closely
to
the bumper, it looks like at one time the lights were on the bumper
and someone removed them and smoothed off the surface before
rechromeing.  I think the actual placement should be like a Ghibli:
on the bumper.

> No side view mirror appears in the brochure (nor were there ones on
many  Italian cars of this era.) Did Ghia of Beverly Hills add them
in order for the cars  to be legal ? If so is the "correct" mirror
the same as a barracuda's?

There is no correct mirror for the car but I can tell you that it
probably should not be a Barracuda's.  In addition, due to the
placement of the wind wing, a mirror is almost useless.  My car has a
mirror but if it didn't, I don't think I would add one.  That
being
said, this is an Italian car with an American drive train.  Look at
what is on a Ghibli.  A Ghibli has a bullet shaped mirror where the
back half of the bullet contains the mirror and rotates around the
front half.  The manufacture of the mirror on my car is Talbot & Co.
in Berlin.

> I assume that all the cars left the factory  with front end
emblems. Many are  now missing (not that hard to imagine). Also,
obviously ghia made up the  script emblem on the rear. Is the front
one unique to these cars to?

I have a number of people trying to find me a front nose emblem and
it doesn't seem to exist and it doesn't seem to have been
used on
other cars.  In understand that it was very fragile which is probably
why they didn't last 35+ years.  I'd like to have them
recreated and
when I do, I'll probably have a few dozen made.
>
> I also assume that all the cars left the factory with Plymouth "S'
options:
> The cooling fin valve covers.
> The low 16"  "273 commando" air cleaner pan. (not the small, tall
ones seen on many barracudas. And in the brochure.)
> The exhaust resonator. (as seen in the brochure.)
> Many of these are missing/swapped-out on these cars today.
>
What I find interesting about your question is the air cleaner pan.
You are the third Ghia owner that doesn't have the low air
cleaner,
myself included.  I suspect that only a few cars came from the Ghia
factory with this air cleaner on the car.  The rest of us had a
simple air cleaner installed.  Therefore, a case can be made that the
air cleaners on our cars are original.

> The above also makes me wonder about the non-plymouth parts. What
Ghia  bodied cars do they also appear on:

> Headlamp bezels ?

Don't know about this one but of the four bezels on my car, one
is
not quite like the other so I would be curious to the answer.

> The radiator (and expansion tank)?

My expansion tank is plastic.  Fits are works perfectly.  I have
posted pictures on in our group.  I don't know if it is original
or
replaced.  I suspect it should be metal.

> I most often hear Maserati. The dash switches ? Older E-Type
switches seem to match perfectly.

Ah, the switches, I have had a number of people trying to find these
switches because I wanted a new set.  I really liked the Maserati
switches that are still available for the early Ghibli's with the
little pictures on the end. The problem is that the Ghia's dash
has
switches that the Ghibli doesn't and visa-versa.  The E-Type
switches
don't have the same toggle type.  I think what Ghia did was find
a
switch base and then custom made the toggle part that presses on to a
stud.  I took on the task of disassembling each of my original
switches and then cleaning them out.  While my mechanic reengineered
the wiring, we made do with what we had.  Everything works as it
should now but we didn't use some of the terminals on some of the
switches.  I have posted a picture of the switches when they were
removed from the dash so if anyone finds a supply, please alert the
group.

> The gauges ?

I  don't know the answer to this question.  Anyone else?

> The tail lights? I seem to recall this was mentioned in a recent
eBay auction.

This is a very interesting question.  The Ghia used the base from a
60s Alfa Guilia and they custom made the lenses.  In the US at the
time, all taillights were red for the brake light and red for the
turn signal.  The Guilia had red for the brake light and yellow for
the turn signal.  Over time, the US allowed this red and yellow
taillight.  I have been told that you can't find a nice set of
red-
red taillights because so few were made.  There is a company in Texas
called Re-Originals that has the red-yellow lights available new.
The ones on eBay were red-yellow.  The final bid was about $75 less
than the price from Re-Originals.  I purchased a set of the red-
yellow lenses and they look great on the car.  I will probably
forever be looking for the red-red lenses but the search is half the
fun.

> The exterior door handles ? also on Mangustas. etc.

The door handles are of the Mangusta and very early Pantera type.
Fairly easy to find.

I hope this information helps, let's keep the dialog going.

Brad

Obviously many of the remaining cars have been modified and
personalized.
But can anyone elaborate on, what I think are, the most common
differences:

Most cars have a hood scoop. But some came without it.

Many cars have a front scoop under the bumper as part of the body,
ala a
Mangusta. Most don't. (you can just make it out on the red one with
the white
top, if you go to the brochure in the photos section.)

Some cars have chrome strips beneath the doors with spring loaded
jack-
hole covers. Most don't.

The turn signal indicators, the blue high beam indicator, and the
green (non
operating on mine) light seem to vary in thier dash placement. As
does the
blank brass plaque on the glove box. ( I have an ad mentioning it
being there
so you could pesonalize your car.)

The license plate lights on the rear bumper vary greatly.

No side view mirror appears in the brochure (nor were there ones on
many
Italian cars of this era.) Did Ghia of Beverly Hills add them in
order for the cars
to be legal ? If so is the "correct" mirror the same as a barracuda's
?

I assume that all the cars left the factory  with front end emblems.
Many are
now missing (not that hard to imagine). Also, obviously ghia made up
the
script emblem on the rear. Is the front one unique to these cars to ?

I also assume that all the cars left the factory with Plymouth "S'
options:
The cooling fin valve covers.
The low 16"  "273 commando" air cleaner pan. (not the small, tall
ones seen
on many barracudas. And in the brochure.)
The exhaust resonator. (as seen in the brochure.)
Many of these are missing/swapped-out on these cars today.

Any thoughts out there. Other than I have too much time on my hands.

The above also makes me wonder about the non-plymouth parts. What
Ghia
bodied cars do they also appear on:
Headlamp bezels ?
The radiator (and expansion tank)  ? I most often hear Maserati.
The dash switches ? Older E-Type switches seem to match perfectly.
The gauges ?
The tail lights ? I seem to recall this was mentioned in a recent
eBay auction.
The exterior door handles ? also on Mangustas.
etc.

I'm always interested in others' thoughts.
Cheers

I just posted pictures of my engine bay and you will note that I have
a plastic expansion tank.  Origin unknown but it is a Chrysler part.

I also added a section to the group called Wanted Parts and placed a
picture of the nose emblem that my car is missing and I know many
other owners don't have.  Any help finding this part would be
appreciated.

Hi Dave - welcome aboard.

Now that we have 3 definate owners on the board (you Brad and I), can
you possibly tell me what your cars have for expansino tanks in them?

You can see my post from November about my tank.  I have been looking
for an alternative to buying the $165 corvette part and having it
modified for mine.  So I would be interested in seeing what yours are...

- Scott

Thank you Brad,(new member also), for turning me on to the group...
I had spoken to Scott over a year ago, when I first aquired my Ghia
and he mentioned his interest in forming the regestry.  Salud to you
Scott, hopefully I/we, (Brad is a very resourceful, passionate young
buckaroo, who seems to come up with the answers), can give this group
a little kick in the pants for becomming a very informative,
insiteful source for the proud owners of a piece of automobile
history and a true work of art.  My Ghia is #4020 and is dark blue
with a black interior, dark blue cloth convertable top, has the hard
top option and metal and cloth tanneaus.  The car is very complete
and in exceptional/original condition.  It's been through a couple of
color changes though originally silver to red or red to silver to the
now blue color, and it suits the car and me just fine.  I wanted to
give my car a more "sporty" appearance so I added dual exhaust with
single slant cut 3" stainless long tips (which compliment the body
line), put Pirelli 205/70/14's on the Borrani wires and added a
larger Talbot style side mirror on the drivers side door.  Subtle
changes, yet adds a mildly aggressive look to the normally
gentalmanly demeure.  The car's interior is all stock with the
exception of a Becker am/fm radio, year correct, has original A/C and
a custom made center arm rest, (really a life saver for long
drives).  Hope to post some pics soon and maybe hear from some of
ya...  I know of a couple of other proud owners and will definitely
inform them of the group.  Dave

I just checked the pictures that you have up on the site and the
Silver one is mine.  Car number 45 formally owned by Dave Roberts.

As for your headlights, I had a similar experience with my dash
lights.  The wiring on these cars is Horrible. There are not enough
fuses, some of the wires aren't the correct gauge for the current and
there aren't enough relays.  I had my entire electrical system
reengineered and all of the wiring replaced.  Now everything works!
The car even runs better because I'm now getting enough power to the
ignition system.  It's an expensive way to go but the way these cars
were wired, they were ticking disasters waiting to happen.  I
recommend highly that if you replace the wiring, don't go with a stock
wiring harness, it's not sufficient for the car.

I have a guy in the LA area that did a great job on my car if anyone
is interested.

Chat with you all later.


Brad

Welcome Brad -

Throw up some pictures if you can, would love to see it.

Mine has the modified nose, so technically I don't need the emblem,
but would like one anyway.

Currenly mine is in various states of dis-assembly:  carb, starter,
and radiator expansion tank.  Also need to trace down a wiring fault
on the headlights.

I just found this group.  I'm glad someone has done this.  I own car
4045, Silver with Red interior.  I'm very glad to part of a small
group of owners.  I have a question for all that are listening:  How
many of you have the front nose emblem?  I'm missing mine and I know
the car at the Peterson Museum in LA is missing its.  Maybe we can all
get together and have a bunch made.  Comments?

Brad

http://www.manchestermotorcar.com/moredetails.html?52739998&sitecode=manchesterm\
otorcar

Good work tracking down a replacement for your car.
For the record:
A good research source for how these cars looked when delivered to
Mr.
Sugarman at Ghia of Beverly Hills (FYI now Ferrari of B.H.) is the
brochure
you have posted in the photos section.
On page two one can see a small but complete picture of the engine
compartment.
Perfectionists will note the tank is rectangular and was fabricated
by Ghia.
Most I've seen first hand are brass and finished in black .
It's my understanding the 450SS and other small quantity cars are
refered to
as "bin cars." Often put together using, sometimes inconsistant,
around the
factory parts.
Also note the rare Plymouth vavle covers and the Ghia gauges. (The
gauge
rims are black (painted) in the brochure but seem to get stripped
down to the
bronze underneath on many resorations).
Once again great work on your part and hopefully this was of interest
to other
Ghia curioso.

in my continuing repair/destruction efforts i have learned something
new this day.

my radiator expansion tank committed corrosive suicide, so i went
shopping for a replacement.  first the good news, the tank is actually
from the 63-67 corvette, harrison model 3155416.  the bad news, ghia
modified the overflow inlet tube, replacing it with a larger diameter
tube that points in a differenet direction....  welded on of course.

i put up pictures in the photo section.

the remanufactured tanks are available here:
http://www.dewitts.com/pages/productdetail.asp?ProdID=93

Found it in the September Hemmings Auction Roundup.

The reviewer definately is not a fan of the car at all....

Condition: refurbished #3 (average?)
bid: 25k, not sold.

comments:  (and I quote)

"The breathy buildup to this bid focused on the car's celebrity
lineage, specifically its original owner, Johnny Carson, the Tonight
show dynast, who, in a bit of auto-collector trivia, turned Jay Leno
into a household name as his frequent stand-in. The 450 SS was an
early, and uninspired, creation of ItalDesign founder Giorgetto
Giugiaro, and this one was acceptable enough, we suppose, from a
presentation standpoint, with a few paint chips and a clean engine
bay. Within that bay, though, was a 273-cu.in. Chrysler V-8, which you
could also get in a Plymouth Valiant, and there was a Mopar-stock
floor shifter. As a certain magazine sweepstakes TV pitchman might put
it, "Heeeeeeeere's mediocrity!""

ouch...

I have a couple of Americanized, homebuilt cars

I am interested in hearing from others with the same.

I have an Italian sportscar that was Americanized, much to the horror of the
Italians.

It is a 1947 Nardi with Crosley engine.



I also have a homebuild race car from 1959, Packard powered (below)




Keen to hear from others with similar tastes.

Daniel


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Best of luck, is an interesting looking beastie...



--- In ghia450ss@yahoogroups.com, danielrapley@a... wrote:
>
> Scott,
>
> Thanks for the suggestion, I will join the group. Perhaps someone
will know
> the car.
>
>
> Daniel
>
>
>
> >
> > If this is an Italian body on a Chrysler drivetrain, I would
> > recommend the following newsgroup:
> >
> > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Ameripowered/
> >
> > They specialize in cross-the-pond hybrids and have some very
> > knowledgable people.
> >
> > Scott
> >
> >
> > --- In ghia450ss@yahoogroups.com, danielrapley@a... wrote:
> > >Hello,
> > >
> > >
> > >I am looking for information on a Chrysler powered car that I
have.
> > I know
> > >very little about it.
> > >
> > >Below is are photos of the car being built in the early 1950's.
It
> > was a car
> > >built by Joe Gertler of NY.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >If the photos are not visible or look like junk you can view
them
> > at the
> > >following webpage.
> > >
> > >http://www.danrapley.com/ItalianBody/OldBody.htm
> > >
> > >I believe there was an article written on the car in a period
> > magazine.
> > >
> > >Does anyone remember the car, or can you direct me to Chrysler
> > discussion
> > >groups or mailing lists?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Cheers,
> > >
> > >Daniel
> > >
> > >
> > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Scott,

Thanks for the suggestion, I will join the group. Perhaps someone will know
the car.


Daniel



>
> If this is an Italian body on a Chrysler drivetrain, I would
> recommend the following newsgroup:
>
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Ameripowered/
>
> They specialize in cross-the-pond hybrids and have some very
> knowledgable people.
>
> Scott
>
>
> --- In ghia450ss@yahoogroups.com, danielrapley@a... wrote:
> >Hello,
> >
> >
> >I am looking for information on a Chrysler powered car that I have.
> I know
> >very little about it.
> >
> >Below is are photos of the car being built in the early 1950's. It
> was a car
> >built by Joe Gertler of NY.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >If the photos are not visible or look like junk you can view them
> at the
> >following webpage.
> >
> >http://www.danrapley.com/ItalianBody/OldBody.htm
> >
> >I believe there was an article written on the car in a period
> magazine.
> >
> >Does anyone remember the car, or can you direct me to Chrysler
> discussion
> >groups or mailing lists?
> >
> >
> >
> >Cheers,
> >
> >Daniel
> >
> >
> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

If this is an Italian body on a Chrysler drivetrain, I would
recommend the following newsgroup:

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Ameripowered/

They specialize in cross-the-pond hybrids and have some very
knowledgable people.

Scott


--- In ghia450ss@yahoogroups.com, danielrapley@a... wrote:
> Hello,
>
>
> I am looking for information on a Chrysler powered car that I have.
I know
> very little about it.
>
> Below is are photos of the car being built in the early 1950's. It
was a car
> built by Joe Gertler of NY.
>
>
>
>
>
> If the photos are not visible or look like junk you can view them
at the
> following webpage.
>
> http://www.danrapley.com/ItalianBody/OldBody.htm
>
> I believe there was an article written on the car in a period
magazine.
>
> Does anyone remember the car, or can you direct me to Chrysler
discussion
> groups or mailing lists?
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Daniel
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello,


I am looking for information on a Chrysler powered car that I have. I know
very little about it.

Below is are photos of the car being built in the early 1950's. It was a car
built by Joe Gertler of NY.





If the photos are not visible or look like junk you can view them at the
following webpage.

http://www.danrapley.com/ItalianBody/OldBody.htm

I believe there was an article written on the car in a period magazine.

Does anyone remember the car, or can you direct me to Chrysler discussion
groups or mailing lists?



Cheers,

Daniel


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Greetings to all.
I have car number 7 having purchased it recently.  I'm sure you will
all remember the excitement of acquiring such a special car, followed
by the thousand questions.  I'm in the question stage.  My car is
largely restored but has quite a number of things to do.  It's dark
blue with tan leather and blue piping, an automatic with hardtop.  So
one more has been accounted for.  I look forward to sharing info with
all as I learn more myself.

Ken (#7

Welcome to our new member, and Happy New Years wishes to
all our existing members.

I have been busy recently pursuing busness related matters and
have not had much time to spend on this or my car.

However, I have recently made contact with someone in Holland
that is looking at purchacing a 450SS in his neighborhood.  It is
a fixer upper from what I gathered from talking with him and the
seller is looking for a lot of $$ for it in its current shape.  I wish
him luck though.   He has sent me a couple of articles from
European sources, and I am in process of gathering info to send
to him.

In better news though, he is looking at getting gas gagues made
if and when he does purchase the car.  I have need of one, and
suppose that there are others that do also.  He has lined up a
source and can place orders for more than 2 (will be doing one
for himslef and one for me).  If we can find others we may be
able to reduce the cost somewhat....

So, good luck and health to all in the coming year.

Scott (27 of 52)

The yankee Candle 450 SS was up for sale at
collectorcaronline.com.
     I'm still curious if anyone out in the vast internet can add any
factual whereabouts or info ( s/n, etc.) to this list of the 52 450
SS' produced ?
1. The one on this site
2. The red one for sale @ VIP Motors in CA. & eBay
3. The silver one for sale @ VIP Motors in CA. & eBay
4. The maroon one, owned by Gary Stevens, as seen on many
sites on the internet
5. The red, ex-Wilt Chamberlin, one for sale in Arizona
6. The red ex-Yankee Candle Museum car
7. The Black one exhibited at the Blackhawk Museum in CA.
8. ??
9. ??
etc.

Bad news on the Yankee Candle Museum -

It is closing, or has already done so, don,t know what is happening
with it's collection.

If it's true that 450 SS' are numbered from BS 4000 to BS 4052
with the Silver one @ V.I.P. Motors being BS 4045 and the one on this
site being BS 4027, also one back east @ the Yankee Candle Museum
numbered BS 4008 and Barret-Jackson has offered one, a few times over
the last few years, maroon, s/n BS 4030 can anyone else on the vast
internet connect any of the other 48 (?) cars with thier serial
numbers ?

Roll call is a good idea.  I hvae been too busy lately to spend much
time doing much of anything, but now I hvae freed up a bit.

I have put a couple pictures up, including 2 cars for sale, at VIP
Classics in California, and a 4 page brocure I found on the web.

I think it's been tried before, but how far can one get with the
help of the intrernet, Hemmings, Car Clubs/Shows, The Italian car
registry, etc. toward accounting for whereabouts/Histories of these
52 cars.
    It seems like this site could be a good place for people to share
facts and speculation alike. 52's not that many.

FYI:<br>There are two currently up for auction at
www.ebay.com.<br>The cars are in California and are both in great
shape.<br>The auctions close on Tuesday morning CA. time and
the owner had previously tried to get $33k and up for
them.<br>Search ebay for Ghia 450 SS, notice the space.<br>Good
Luck.

Hi there,<br><br>now we're three!<br>I don't know
if this is going to be something like a
break-through, but three is more than two. And this is for
sure.<br>I am searching after a 450 SS to buy. A couple of
days ago I found one in Switzerland. The owner is
asking 39,000 SFr (19,000 USD). I am afraid the
condition isn't that good so the restoration is going to
cost me at least the same amount.<br>What is your
opinion?<br><br>Any ideas?<br>Bye for now,<br><br><br>Dragos

I have uploaded some pictures, and will be doing so with some regularity
(hopefully).<br><br>Yahoo clubs require one to be a member to view the pix, so
feel free to join, all are welcome.

Welcome to the Yahoo! Message Board for Ghia 450SS