Max, Jerry,

Thanks - I'll have to go back and look at the one in the garage again.

After I posted my original question, I realised that it didn't make
complete sense, since it should be possible with a hybrid car to
switch it "on" without running the engine, and in that state to take
power from the main battery. This would be OK, since I assume the
car's computer won't allow the main battery to be run down too far.

However, I'm curious about the 3 statuses ACC, IG-ON and READY. How
does the power button allow one to choose which status you want -
it's not like a key which has 3 positions?

John

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "maxvok" <maxvok@y...> wrote:
> John,
> In my lefthand drive car there is a second socket at the regular
> cigarette lighter position but in the dutch Manual page 226, it is
> stated that this does not apply to the righthand drive version. It
> also mentions that you may not draw more than 12V/120W and not to
> use it longer than necessary if the hybrid system is not on.
> Max
>
> --- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
> wrote:
> > John
> >
> > My Prius has one socket inside the front wall of the armrest
cubby
> hole. If there is another one I have yet to find it. It will work
at
> any state except IG-OFF. So it will work at ACC, at IG-ON or at
> READY. I would assume, but am not certain, that at IG-ON power
could
> be drawn almost indefinitely since the battery array would recharge
> the accessory 12v battery. Possibly someone more knowledgeable,
such
> as Richard S can confirm that?
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Jerry
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: John Allen
> > To: Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 10:27 PM
> > Subject: [Prius-Europe] Power socket question
> >
> >
> > I've read somewhere in one of the Prius forums that the Prius
2004
> > has two 12-volt power sockets(cigar lighter type) somewhere in
the
> > front area of the car (ie not in the boot), which are switched
off
> > when the car is switched off.
> >
> > Could a European Prius owner confirm
> >
> > - the location of these sockets?
> >
> > - whether it is correct that no 12-volt power is available
through
> > these sockets when the car is switched off?
> >
> > This could be a considerable drawback as I like to go flying
radio-
> > controlled model aircraft with my son, and we use the power
> sockets
> > in our Passat to run battery chargers at the flying field, for
> this,
> > the power needs to be available when the car is parked. The
> Passat's
> > sockets are always live.
> >
> > I guess the small capacity of the Prius's 12 volt battery makes
it
> > difficult to run anything else off it. On the other hand, it is
> > ironical that a car with a huge onboard battery has (as far as I
> > know) no way to provide an amp or two to power something plugged
> into
> > the car.
> >
> > John Allen
> > Bofferdange
> > Luxembourg
> > http://www.homepages.lu/allen

John,
In my lefthand drive car there is a second socket at the regular
cigarette lighter position but in the dutch Manual page 226, it is
stated that this does not apply to the righthand drive version. It
also mentions that you may not draw more than 12V/120W and not to
use it longer than necessary if the hybrid system is not on.
Max

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
wrote:
> John
>
> My Prius has one socket inside the front wall of the armrest cubby
hole. If there is another one I have yet to find it. It will work at
any state except IG-OFF. So it will work at ACC, at IG-ON or at
READY. I would assume, but am not certain, that at IG-ON power could
be drawn almost indefinitely since the battery array would recharge
the accessory 12v battery. Possibly someone more knowledgeable, such
as Richard S can confirm that?
>
> Regards
>
> Jerry
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Allen
> To: Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 10:27 PM
> Subject: [Prius-Europe] Power socket question
>
>
> I've read somewhere in one of the Prius forums that the Prius 2004
> has two 12-volt power sockets(cigar lighter type) somewhere in the
> front area of the car (ie not in the boot), which are switched off
> when the car is switched off.
>
> Could a European Prius owner confirm
>
> - the location of these sockets?
>
> - whether it is correct that no 12-volt power is available through
> these sockets when the car is switched off?
>
> This could be a considerable drawback as I like to go flying radio-
> controlled model aircraft with my son, and we use the power
sockets
> in our Passat to run battery chargers at the flying field, for
this,
> the power needs to be available when the car is parked. The
Passat's
> sockets are always live.
>
> I guess the small capacity of the Prius's 12 volt battery makes it
> difficult to run anything else off it. On the other hand, it is
> ironical that a car with a huge onboard battery has (as far as I
> know) no way to provide an amp or two to power something plugged
into
> the car.
>
> John Allen
> Bofferdange
> Luxembourg
> http://www.homepages.lu/allen

I've read somewhere in one of the Prius forums that the Prius 2004
has two 12-volt power sockets(cigar lighter type) somewhere in the
front area of the car (ie not in the boot), which are switched off
when the car is switched off.

Could a European Prius owner confirm

- the location of these sockets?

- whether it is correct that no 12-volt power is available through
these sockets when the car is switched off?

This could be a considerable drawback as I like to go flying radio-
controlled model aircraft with my son, and we use the power sockets
in our Passat to run battery chargers at the flying field, for this,
the power needs to be available when the car is parked. The Passat's
sockets are always live.

I guess the small capacity of the Prius's 12 volt battery makes it
difficult to run anything else off it. On the other hand, it is
ironical that a car with a huge onboard battery has (as far as I
know) no way to provide an amp or two to power something plugged into
the car.

John Allen
Bofferdange
Luxembourg
http://www.homepages.lu/allen

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "priusmaniac" <priusmaniac@y...>
wrote:
> I know one car rental company in Brussels that is renting the Prius.
>
> They have at least one car of the first generation.
>
> A.A.A. Economic Location
> Rue du Trône 154
> B-1050 Brussels
> Belgium
>
> Tel: + 32 2 648 23 24
> Fax: + 32 2 649 34 26
>
> E-mail: aaa.rent-a-car.m2@b...
>
> Best regards
>
> Patrick
Patrick,

Thanks to you and to Richard for the hints. Brussels might be a
possibility but I'll wait until they have a new model to rent.

John

John Allen
Bofferdange, Luxembourg
http://www.homepages.lu/allen

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "priusmaniac" <priusmaniac@y...>
wrote:
> Hi to all,
> This is a very good idea.
> There are indeed many questions that are specific to Europe.
> The gas price at 1 Euro/liter, the important presence of diesel
cars, the greener electricity and so on.
> This will be a good place to talk about the Prius in the particular
> European context.
> Thanks to Jerry for creating this group.
>
> Patrick

Patrick, welcome!

I have put a new database in the databases section. It is a simple
one to document petrol and diesel prices across Europe. I hope
everyone will have a look at this and the other two databases, and
add any details for their own countries.

Be careful though, unfortunately the way Yahoo have set it, anyone
can enter data, but only moderators can then edit or delete it. There
is no capability for people to be able to edit their own entries. Any
problems, just send me an email direct

regards

Jerry

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "maxvok" <maxvok@y...> wrote:
> Sorry Jerry I had not checked the links, only looked at uploaded
> Files.Wonder how long some of these links will remain active and
> whether you should not save the really interesting articles as a
> file, this particular one will probably remain forever.
> BTW have you found already www.prius.com ? Easy directory for all
> european countries and official information such as pricelist etc.
> Max
>

Max

Yes, I have seen Prius.com [and now I have put it in the links
section] although I had not appreciated that it contains prices etc.
for so many different countries.

I am not sure how to save some of the road tests as files when they
have several interlinked pages & so forth. Is it easy? Do we have
perhaps a volunteer, to convert the existing links into files?

Regards

Jerry

Hello John,

I know one car rental company in Brussels that is renting the Prius.

They have at least one car of the first generation.

A.A.A. Economic Location
Rue du Trône 154
B-1050 Brussels
Belgium

Tel: + 32 2 648 23 24
Fax: + 32 2 649 34 26

E-mail: aaa.rent-a-car.m2@...

Best regards

Patrick

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "John Allen" <allen@v...> wrote:
Does anyone know if you can rent a Prius
> anywhere in Europe?
>
> John Allen
> Bofferdange, Luxembourg
> http://www.homepages.lu/allen

Hi to all,

This is a very good idea.

There are indeed many questions that are specific to Europe.

The gas price at 1 Euro/liter, the important presence of diesel cars,
the greener electricity and so on.

This will be a good place to talk about the Prius in the particular
European context.

Thanks to Jerry for creating this group.

Patrick

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
wrote:
> Welcome to all new members of this group. Please encourage your
> friends and relatives to join!
>
> The first message to this group from each new member is moderated,
> and for the first few days/weeks this may take a little time, so
> please be patient...
>
> Jerry Whitmarsh
> Group Owner

Sorry Jerry I had not checked the links, only looked at uploaded
Files.Wonder how long some of these links will remain active and
whether you should not save the really interesting articles as a
file, this particular one will probably remain forever.
BTW have you found already www.prius.com ? Easy directory for all
european countries and official information such as pricelist etc.
Max



--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
wrote:
> --- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, maxvok@y... wrote:
>
>
> > article on selection of Prius as Car of the Year 2004 in the US
> <snip>
>
> Please note that there is already a link to this article in the
links
> section of this Site, in the folder "Road Tests etc"
>
> I have put about 4 or 5 other road tests in too, but please do let
me
> know if you are aware of any others...
>
> comments on the new home page also welcomed..
>
> Jerry
> UK

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, maxvok@y... wrote:


> article on selection of Prius as Car of the Year 2004 in the US
<snip>

Please note that there is already a link to this article in the links
section of this Site, in the folder "Road Tests etc"

I have put about 4 or 5 other road tests in too, but please do let me
know if you are aware of any others...

comments on the new home page also welcomed..

Jerry
UK

A small rental company here in vienna/austria had a classic Prius some time
ago. But it was rather expensive, because it rated as kind of luxury car
(A/C auto, automatic transmission).

Richard

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Allen" <allen@...>
To: <Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: [Prius-Europe] Prius in Luxembourg - update


> I called the dealer here today to check a couple of things:
>
> - delivery now quoted as June (was May a month ago)
>
> - I asked about test drives, but they only have one car available and
> can offer only short accompanied drives, I'd hoped to borrow or even
> rent a car for a day or two. Does anyone know if you can rent a Prius
> anywhere in Europe?
>
> John Allen
> Bofferdange, Luxembourg
> http://www.homepages.lu/allen
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

I called the dealer here today to check a couple of things:

- delivery now quoted as June (was May a month ago)

- I asked about test drives, but they only have one car available and
can offer only short accompanied drives, I'd hoped to borrow or even
rent a car for a day or two. Does anyone know if you can rent a Prius
anywhere in Europe?

John Allen
Bofferdange, Luxembourg
http://www.homepages.lu/allen

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the Prius-Europe
group.

   File        : /THS_II.pdf
   Uploaded by : jerry_whitmarsh <jerry@...>
   Description : A technical document explaining THS II

You can access this file at the URL

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius-Europe/files/THS_II.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit

http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

jerry_whitmarsh <jerry@...>

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the Prius-Europe
group.

   File        : /04GBPressRelease.pdf
   Uploaded by : jerry_whitmarsh <jerry@...>
   Description : UK Press Release for the 04 Prius - 70 Pages!

You can access this file at the URL

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius-Europe/files/04GBPressRelease.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit

http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

jerry_whitmarsh <jerry@...>

I have created in the Database a Table for actual Invoice/Offer
prices and hope that everybody with data will add a record so that
we can quikly compare. (Jerry, please check/edit)
There is a limitation of 10 columns and 1000 records so that I had
to make some arbitrary choices what to present. Any comments to
improve are welcome. If necessary we could add another table for
further details.
The 2 NL records are mine from 2 different dealers of which the
Offer had a delivery in May and the Invoice was the only immediately
available car in my preferred color silver and more attractive
because I could give my 12 year old Mazda 626 2.0HB (112000 km some
fender damage otherwise still perfect) to my daughter as the 6% cash
discount was the same as the trade-in from the Offer !

Max


--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
wrote:
> --- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "realarms" <rscheff@c...>
wrote:
> >
> > I'm under the impression, that the european base net price is
about
> > 21300 EUR excluding all taxes.
> >
> > Seems to be valid at least for .at and .de
> >
> > Anyone with a hold on their local tax structure able to confirm
> this
> > figure?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >    Richard
>
> Richard, welcome!
>
> The following is what I paid for my Prius, before discounts, last
> month:
>
> 			 £          Euro
>
> Base Price 	 16503.83 23576.9
> Delivery 		  424.00   605.7
> Metallic paint 		  255.32   364.7
> Licence plates 		   25.00    35.7
> First registration fee 	   25.00    35.7
> Road tax 		   65.00    92.9
> VAT 			 3011.43  4302.0
>
> Total 		 20309.58 29013.6
>
>
> Does anyone have a similar breakdown for their country? I suspect
it
> may be bad news for the British :-(
>
> Jerry
> Maidstone, UK

I think we have all seen the problems with the early grey imports of the
classic Prius - basically, if they go wrong, often they can't be
economically repaired, and the dealers are pretty unhelpful.

I wouldn't touch a Prius without a cast iron warranty - I'm not very
impressed by the 3 year warranty on the new version either.

Atlanta

-----Original Message----
From: Richard Scheffenegger [mailto:rscheff@...]
Sent: 02 March 2004 22:46
To: Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Prius-Europe] Re: Prius Pricing



So, that base price of  16500 GBP is about 24670 EUR currently...

Phew...

And I thought 21300 was high ;)

But it seems that toyota adjusts the base price now in the US up by 300 USD.

But in japan (also RHD) the Prius would cost only about 10450 GBP - I wonder
why noone is really considering shipping from Japan (even with 10% EU import
customs and the typical fees / taxes, and special licencing cost, including
perhaps some mods to the light system, it should pay off, not?

Richard


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@...>
To: <Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 10:33 PM
Subject: [Prius-Europe] Prius Pricing


--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "realarms" <rscheff@c...> wrote:
>
> I'm under the impression, that the european base net price is about
> 21300 EUR excluding all taxes.
>
> Seems to be valid at least for .at and .de
>
> Anyone with a hold on their local tax structure able to confirm
this
> figure?
>
> Thanks,
>    Richard

Richard, welcome!

The following is what I paid for my Prius, before discounts, last
month:

£          Euro

Base Price 16503.83 23576.9
Delivery   424.00   605.7
Metallic paint   255.32   364.7
Licence plates    25.00    35.7
First registration fee    25.00    35.7
Road tax    65.00    92.9
VAT 3011.43 4302.0

Total 20309.58 29013.6


Does anyone have a similar breakdown for their country? I suspect it
may be bad news for the British :-(

Jerry
Maidstone, UK





Yahoo! Groups Links









Yahoo! Groups Links

So, that base price of  16500 GBP is about 24670 EUR currently...

Phew...

And I thought 21300 was high ;)

But it seems that toyota adjusts the base price now in the US up by 300 USD.

But in japan (also RHD) the Prius would cost only about 10450 GBP - I wonder
why noone is really considering shipping from Japan (even with 10% EU import
customs and the typical fees / taxes, and special licencing cost, including
perhaps some mods to the light system, it should pay off, not?

Richard


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@...>
To: <Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 10:33 PM
Subject: [Prius-Europe] Prius Pricing


--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "realarms" <rscheff@c...> wrote:
>
> I'm under the impression, that the european base net price is about
> 21300 EUR excluding all taxes.
>
> Seems to be valid at least for .at and .de
>
> Anyone with a hold on their local tax structure able to confirm
this
> figure?
>
> Thanks,
>    Richard

Richard, welcome!

The following is what I paid for my Prius, before discounts, last
month:

£          Euro

Base Price 16503.83 23576.9
Delivery   424.00   605.7
Metallic paint   255.32   364.7
Licence plates    25.00    35.7
First registration fee    25.00    35.7
Road tax    65.00    92.9
VAT 3011.43 4302.0

Total 20309.58 29013.6


Does anyone have a similar breakdown for their country? I suspect it
may be bad news for the British :-(

Jerry
Maidstone, UK





Yahoo! Groups Links

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "realarms" <rscheff@c...> wrote:
>
> I'm under the impression, that the european base net price is about
> 21300 EUR excluding all taxes.
>
> Seems to be valid at least for .at and .de
>
> Anyone with a hold on their local tax structure able to confirm
this
> figure?
>
> Thanks,
>    Richard

Richard, welcome!

The following is what I paid for my Prius, before discounts, last
month:

				 £          Euro

Base Price 	 16503.83 23576.9
Delivery 		  424.00   605.7
Metallic paint 		  255.32   364.7
Licence plates 		   25.00    35.7
First registration fee 	   25.00    35.7
Road tax 		   65.00    92.9
VAT 			 3011.43  4302.0

Total 		 20309.58 29013.6


Does anyone have a similar breakdown for their country? I suspect it
may be bad news for the British :-(

Jerry
Maidstone, UK

I'm under the impression, that the european base net price is about
21300 EUR excluding all taxes.

Seems to be valid at least for .at and .de

Anyone with a hold on their local tax structure able to confirm this
figure?

Thanks,
    Richard

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "maxvok" <maxvok@y...> wrote:

>
> Hi Jerry,
>  Welcome to the Prii Groups crowd, you must be # 26 as I cannot
find
> your group yet in the directory:<snip>

Max

Welcome! You are right, Yahoo is slow to update its records. No doubt
it will be along in a minute..


Jerry

--- In Prius-Europe@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry Whitmarsh" <jerry@j...>
wrote:
> Welcome to all new members of this group. Please encourage your
> friends and relatives to join!
>
> The first message to this group from each new member is moderated,
> and for the first few days/weeks this may take a little time, so
> please be patient...
>
> Jerry Whitmarsh
> Group Owner

Hi Jerry,
  Welcome to the Prii Groups crowd, you must be # 26 as I cannot find
your group yet in the directory:

http://autos.dir.groups.yahoo.com/dir/Recreation___Sports/Automotive/
Makes_and_Models/Toyota/Prius?st=0&show_groups=1

It would be nice to have a european group but I doubt that it will
eliminate the country groups as language will be a barrier and local
conditions differ quite a bit. Anyhow let us see how it develops.

Frankly I am a bit puzzled which Groups I should join as it is
impossible to follow them all. But if a Dutchman reads this message,
I suggest he has a look at Prius-2004-NL at

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/prius-nl/

With a dutch sales target/allocation of 1000 this year, of which
over 50 % seems to be already ordered, I hope there should be soon
sufficient critical mass to make this Dutch language Group viable.

Regards,
Max

Excellent plan Jerry - thanks for organising!
Atlanta
(UK 2002 silver Prius)

Everyone

[this is a copy of a message posted to those Europe base Yahoo Prius
Groups I have found]

I was interested to see that a new Netherlands group has been started
up. There is also a French Group with 36 members and a UK group with
245 members last count. My concern is that these national groups will
proliferate, as 2004 Prii are marketed in Europe, but like the
existing groups they will have trouble forming a large enough
community to really prosper.

Therefore, I have started a new group called Prius-Europe. This group
is NOT intended to compete with or to replace individual national
groups. The aim is for everyone who has or is interested in the EU
spec Prius to join, and thereby form a large, lively and powerful
group. Thos who belong to US dominated groups such as 2004-Prius and
the new Prius-2G group [which I help to moderate] will know that they
do discuss many interesting topics, but the majority of them are US
specific – like supply difficulties, adding EV buttons we already
have, tax issues, and so forth.

I think we have a great deal to gain by [for example] comparing notes
about the prices, taxes, service costs, and other factors which may
vary in different parts of Europe but should not.

So please, I hope everyone will join the group. It can be found at:

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius-Europe/?yguid=84499017

or just by doing a search of Yahoo automotive Groups

regards to all

Jerry Whitmarsh
yahoo@...

Welcome to all new members of this group. Please encourage your
friends and relatives to join!

The first message to this group from each new member is moderated,
and for the first few days/weeks this may take a little time, so
please be patient...

Jerry Whitmarsh
Group Owner